[Swift-devel] CPU usage with provider-deef
Ioan Raicu
iraicu at cs.uchicago.edu
Tue Jun 19 14:07:36 CDT 2007
Hi,
See below:
Mike Wilde wrote:
> Ioan, I feel that documenting the message flow is key to understanding
> the system, and that such documentation will be indispensable for you
> (and the Swift team) to make progress with Falkon.
Yes, I agree!
>
>
> If its the case, as you stated to me, that you dont have the time to
> fully support Falkon for end-user use, which I accept, then the only
> way to enable the Swift team to provide this support is for us to
> understand the tool.
Agreed!
>
>
> The three things you propose to communicate to us in a face-to-face
> meeting (organization of the code, the message flow diagram,
> configuration options) are exactly the things that need to be documented.
The message flow diagram is already in the SC paper, and if not there,
in the provisioning paper I write a few weeks later that was never
submitted anywhere.... the Falkon paper is at
http://people.cs.uchicago.edu/~iraicu/research/docs/Falkon/Falkon_SC07_v17-submitted.pdf
(section 3.2, Figure 2), and the DRP paper is at
http://people.cs.uchicago.edu/~iraicu/research/docs/DRP/DRP_v01.doc
(section 3.2 and Figure 1). Note that the latest Falkon paper (v24)
does not have this message flow diagram. As for the organization of the
code and configuration options, I will certainly do them, but for now
they are not high on my to-do list. I know Mihael, Ben and everyone
else wants written docs, but I can't keep spending 90% of my time on
non-research related issues, as I have been doing recently. Getting
Nika's MolDyn application running over Falkon has literally consummed
all of my time recently. I don't mind doing it, especially when we have
some results to show for (last night we ran the 100 molecule run
successfully, I'll send out a separate update on this later), but I need
to get back to the data management (which is almost ready, but unless I
get a few quiet days to finish it up, it will never get done), my
proposal, etc. I'll get to these eventually, but I can't promise when;
in the meantime, I offer my time to meet in person with whoever wants to
dig into Falkon further!
>
>
> But you and Ian together need to decide and propose how you want to
> see Falkon used and how you intend to make it supportable for that
> purpose.
I am OK to support Falkon (as you have already seen with me helping Nika
one on one, talking to Tibi about his app, getting Falkon in as an
incubator project to setup CVS, mailing lists, etc....), but I hope to
avoid making Falkon support be 90% of my time, which has been the case
recently :(.
>
> For Swift's goals, we *know* we need Falkon's capabilities to succeed,
> and the question is how much and how long can we use Falkon, and when
> would we need to start improving or rewriting it.
>
These are all very good questions, and only time will answer these, IMO.
Ioan
> - Mike
>
>
>
>
> Mihael Hategan wrote, On 6/19/2007 3:22 AM:
>> On Mon, 2007-06-18 at 16:37 -0500, Ioan Raicu wrote:
>>> There is a diagram in the SC paper that has the flow of messages, and
>>> what each does; these messages also map to the WSDL of the Falkon
>>> service. Mihael, Ben, or whoever else wants to start digging through
>>> the Falkon code, maybe a meeting might be good to go over the
>>> organization of the code, the message flow diagram, configuration
>>> options, etc... I would prefer a meeting over drafting up more
>>> documents, I think it would be more time effective for me for now.
>>
>> It might be the reverse for us. It's unlikely that faced with a lot of
>> new information, we will consistently retain all of it. Something of
>> reference might be handy.
>>
>>> Ioan
>>>
>>> Ben Clifford wrote:
>>>> The WSDL should describe part of the web services bit of the
>>>> protocol. That might be a good place to start. The WSDL should
>>>> already describe the messages that go over the wire in something
>>>> vaguely readable to a human. Probably what would be needed would be
>>>> the extra info to say which order messages are sent.
>>>>
>>>> On Sat, 16 Jun 2007, Mike Wilde wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> I think a nice clean message sequence chart describing Falkon's
>>>>> various
>>>>> activities would be very useful, as its the backbone of its logic.
>>>>>
>>>>> I tried to create this for the SC paper by asking Ioan to describe
>>>>> the
>>>>> protocol to me, but I dod not succeed.
>>>>>
>>>>> I think this would be a very useful description to maintain, as a
>>>>> UML sequence
>>>>> chart, and that Ioan this would be a very important part of your
>>>>> thesis or of
>>>>> future papers.
>>>>>
>>>>> Its up to you and Ian to weigh whether this would be valuable to your
>>>>> research. I think its invaluable for design, review and debugging.
>>>>>
>>>>> - Mike
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Mihael Hategan wrote, On 6/16/2007 3:15 PM:
>>>>>
>>>>>> On Sat, 2007-06-16 at 19:52 +0000, Ian Foster wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I wasn't suggesting (at least in the first instance) that Mihael
>>>>>>> take the
>>>>>>> prototype and turn it into production, but that Mihael and Ioan
>>>>>>> sit down
>>>>>>> together and do a code walkthrough. I think that this would likely
>>>>>>> identify bugs and opportunities for simplification.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> It's somewhat on the same in level of fun :). From the experience
>>>>>> I've
>>>>>> accumulated so far, design is hard. Understanding prototype
>>>>>> design is
>>>>>> probably even harder (not only do you need to understand the
>>>>>> problem,
>>>>>> you also need to understand why many non-obvious things are done
>>>>>> the way
>>>>>> they are done).
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Mihael
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Ian
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Sent via BlackBerry from T-Mobile
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>> From: Ben Clifford <benc at hawaga.org.uk>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Date: Sat, 16 Jun 2007 19:36:17 To:Mihael Hategan
>>>>>>> <hategan at mcs.anl.gov>
>>>>>>> Cc:swift-devel at ci.uchicago.edu
>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [Swift-devel] CPU usage with provider-deef
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Sat, 16 Jun 2007, Mihael Hategan wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On Sat, 2007-06-16 at 12:03 -0500, Mike Wilde wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> This should be fun, and a nice break from the I2U2 work that
>>>>>>>>> you've
>>>>>>>>> been immersed in, Mihael.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I have my reservations towards the amount of fun it involves.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Right, taking prototypes and turning them into production isn't
>>>>>>> necessarily fun - in fact, a lot of the fun already happened
>>>>>>> with the
>>>>>>> making of the prototype and the rest is some what drugery. (to
>>>>>>> an extent
>>>>>>> that's the same situation i2u2 cosmic was/is in).
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>> Swift-devel mailing list
>>>>>> Swift-devel at ci.uchicago.edu
>>>>>> http://mail.ci.uchicago.edu/mailman/listinfo/swift-devel
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>> Swift-devel at ci.uchicago.edu
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>>>>
>>>>
>>> --
>>> ============================================
>>> Ioan Raicu
>>> Ph.D. Student
>>> ============================================
>>> Distributed Systems Laboratory
>>> Computer Science Department
>>> University of Chicago
>>> 1100 E. 58th Street, Ryerson Hall
>>> Chicago, IL 60637
>>> ============================================
>>> Email: iraicu at cs.uchicago.edu
>>> Web: http://www.cs.uchicago.edu/~iraicu
>>> http://dsl.cs.uchicago.edu/
>>> ============================================
>>> ============================================
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Swift-devel mailing list
>>> Swift-devel at ci.uchicago.edu
>>> http://mail.ci.uchicago.edu/mailman/listinfo/swift-devel
>>
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>>
>
--
============================================
Ioan Raicu
Ph.D. Student
============================================
Distributed Systems Laboratory
Computer Science Department
University of Chicago
1100 E. 58th Street, Ryerson Hall
Chicago, IL 60637
============================================
Email: iraicu at cs.uchicago.edu
Web: http://www.cs.uchicago.edu/~iraicu
http://dsl.cs.uchicago.edu/
============================================
============================================
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