<html xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:w="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:st1="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags" xmlns="http://www.w3.org/TR/REC-html40">
<head>
<meta http-equiv=Content-Type content="text/html; charset=iso-8859-1">
<meta name=Generator content="Microsoft Word 11 (filtered medium)">
<!--[if !mso]>
<style>
v\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);}
o\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);}
w\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);}
.shape {behavior:url(#default#VML);}
</style>
<![endif]--><o:SmartTagType
namespaceuri="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags" name="country-region"/>
<o:SmartTagType namespaceuri="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags"
name="Street"/>
<o:SmartTagType namespaceuri="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags"
name="address"/>
<o:SmartTagType namespaceuri="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags"
name="PlaceType"/>
<o:SmartTagType namespaceuri="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags"
name="PlaceName"/>
<o:SmartTagType namespaceuri="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags"
name="City"/>
<o:SmartTagType namespaceuri="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags"
name="place" downloadurl="http://www.5iantlavalamp.com/"/>
<o:SmartTagType namespaceuri="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags"
name="PersonName"/>
<!--[if !mso]>
<style>
st1\:*{behavior:url(#default#ieooui) }
</style>
<![endif]-->
<style>
<!--
/* Font Definitions */
@font-face
{font-family:Wingdings;
panose-1:5 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0;}
@font-face
{font-family:Tahoma;
panose-1:2 11 6 4 3 5 4 4 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:sans-serif;
panose-1:0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0;}
/* Style Definitions */
p.MsoNormal, li.MsoNormal, div.MsoNormal
{margin:0cm;
margin-bottom:.0001pt;
font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:"Times New Roman";}
p.MsoTitle, li.MsoTitle, div.MsoTitle
{margin-top:12.0pt;
margin-right:0cm;
margin-bottom:3.0pt;
margin-left:0cm;
text-align:center;
font-size:16.0pt;
font-family:Arial;
font-weight:bold;}
a:link, span.MsoHyperlink
{color:blue;
text-decoration:underline;}
a:visited, span.MsoHyperlinkFollowed
{color:purple;
text-decoration:underline;}
p
{mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
margin-right:0cm;
mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;
margin-left:0cm;
font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:"Times New Roman";}
tt
{font-family:"Courier New";}
p.SubTitle, li.SubTitle, div.SubTitle
{margin-top:12.0pt;
margin-right:0cm;
margin-bottom:3.0pt;
margin-left:0cm;
text-align:center;
font-size:14.0pt;
font-family:Arial;
font-weight:bold;}
span.EmailStyle20
{mso-style-type:personal-reply;
font-family:Arial;
color:navy;}
@page Section1
{size:612.0pt 792.0pt;
margin:72.0pt 90.0pt 72.0pt 90.0pt;}
div.Section1
{page:Section1;}
-->
</style>
</head>
<body lang=EN-US link=blue vlink=purple>
<div class=Section1>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Hi,<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>I am not sure if it is possible to tunnel
an entire venue server.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>What would be useful would be to have a
bridge server hosted on a multicast enabled network. This bridge server would
allow you to use the venue client in “unicast” mode. This would
make a unicast connection to the bridge server and then the bridge server would
make the multicast connection.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>You are welcome to use the AGSC venue
server just now to try this out (<a
href="https://ag2server.ag.manchester.ac.uk/Venues/default">https://ag2server.ag.manchester.ac.uk/Venues/default</a>).
This is an AGTk version 2.4 venue server, but we are bringing an experimental
AGTk 3.0 server on line within a week (hopefully). All venues on our server
are bridged, although it is worth noting that this is still running as a “best
efforts” server in that we try our best to keep it running at all times,
but don’t guarantee that it is.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>If this works out, there may be scope for
adding more venues, although I will have to speak to my team here to see if
this is possible. In this case, we would need a set of multicast addresses
that you would want to use for the venues anyway – we don’t have
any spare ones to use.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>I don’t think there are any specific
requirements to set up multicast routing, but I am not an expert in this
field. I would guess that you need your router, and every router between yours
and another multicast router to be multicast enabled. I would then think that
each router needs to know about the other multicast routers, although this may
be done using a protocol, I am not too sure.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Let me know if I can help any more,<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Andrew </span></font><font size=2
color=navy face=Wingdings><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Wingdings;
color:navy'>J</span></font><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<div>
<p><font size=2 color=navy face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:10.0pt;
color:navy'>============================================<br>
Access Grid Support Centre,<br>
RSS Group,<br>
<st1:place w:st="on"><st1:City w:st="on">Manchester</st1:City></st1:place>
Computing,<br>
<st1:place w:st="on"><st1:PlaceName w:st="on">Kilburn</st1:PlaceName> <st1:PlaceType
w:st="on">Building</st1:PlaceType></st1:place>,<br>
<st1:place w:st="on"><st1:PlaceType w:st="on">University</st1:PlaceType> of <st1:PlaceName
w:st="on">Manchester</st1:PlaceName></st1:place>,<br>
<st1:Street w:st="on"><st1:address w:st="on">Oxford Road</st1:address></st1:Street>,<br>
<st1:place w:st="on"><st1:City w:st="on">Manchester</st1:City></st1:place>,<br>
M13 9PL,<br>
<st1:place w:st="on"><st1:country-region w:st="on">UK</st1:country-region></st1:place><br>
Tel: +44(0)161-275 0685<br>
Email: <st1:PersonName w:st="on">Andrew.Rowley@manchester.ac.uk</st1:PersonName></span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div style='border:none;border-left:solid blue 1.5pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 4.0pt'>
<div>
<div class=MsoNormal align=center style='text-align:center'><font size=3
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt'>
<hr size=2 width="100%" align=center tabindex=-1>
</span></font></div>
<p class=MsoNormal><b><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Tahoma;font-weight:bold'>From:</span></font></b><font size=2
face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'>
Fabrizio.Berdondini@prototipo.it [mailto:Fabrizio.Berdondini@prototipo.it] <br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></b> 12 May 2006 09:08<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>To:</span></b> <st1:PersonName w:st="on">Andrew.Rowley@manchester.ac.uk</st1:PersonName><br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Cc:</span></b> <st1:PersonName w:st="on">ag-tech@mcs.anl.gov</st1:PersonName><br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></b> RE: [AG-TECH] Venues
Addresses: infrastructural question</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'><br>
</span></font><font size=2 face=sans-serif><span style='font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:sans-serif'>Thank you very much Andrew,</span></font> <br>
<font size=2 face=sans-serif><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:sans-serif'>quite
clear right now....</span></font> <br>
<br>
<font size=2 face=sans-serif><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:sans-serif'>And
now the question is...</span></font> <br>
<br>
<font size=2 face=sans-serif><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:sans-serif'>We
are studying the development of an infrastructure for reasearch purposes
focused on domiciliar monitoring of patients with Alzheimer's desease, leaving
in islands or difficult to reach areas. It will be developed in collaboration
with the Italian Ministry Of Health and other public structures, such as ISS
(Istituto Superiore Sanità). We thought to base it onto the AccessGrid
infrastructure. Thus we would need to have a couple of VenueServers connected
to the Mbone in order to provide connectivity via Multicast for each
videoconference dedicated machine at patient's home and for a central
"Call Center", connected, again via videoconference dedicated
machines, to some caregivers'/medicians' houses/hospitals.</span></font> <br>
<font size=2 face=sans-serif><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:sans-serif'>Would
it be possible, and eventually how, to "tunnell" our VenueServer(s)
in order to link it/them to the Mbone? How, and which pre-requisites are needed
in order to require/gain access to the Mbone infrastructure?</span></font> <br>
<font size=2 face=sans-serif><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:sans-serif'>Thank
you, as always, for your support,</span></font> <br>
<font size=2 face=sans-serif><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:sans-serif'>Faber
B.</span></font> <br>
<br>
<tt><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'>"Andrew
A Rowley" <<st1:PersonName w:st="on">Andrew.Rowley@manchester.ac.uk</st1:PersonName>>
scritti il 11/05/2006 12.44.34</span></font></tt><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier New"'><br>
<br>
<tt><font face="Courier New">> Hi,</font></tt></span></font> <br>
<tt><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'>> </span></font></tt>
<br>
<tt><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'>> As far
as I understand it:</span></font></tt> <br>
<tt><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'>> 1) The
IP is a real multicast IP, with global scope.</span></font></tt> <br>
<tt><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'>> 2) I
think <st1:place w:st="on">Argonne</st1:place> has reserved the IPs that they
use with IANA. If</span></font></tt><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier New"'><br>
<tt><font face="Courier New">> you want to run a venue server, I would
advise you do the same, or </font></tt><br>
<tt><font face="Courier New">> use your GLOP space. At the AGSC we
only use static addresses. The</font></tt><br>
<tt><font face="Courier New">> server keeps track of the IPs in use
internally – no talking is done</font></tt><br>
<tt><font face="Courier New">> between servers.</font></tt></span></font> <br>
<tt><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'>> 3) This
is standard multicast routing. Vic and rat communicate </span></font></tt><font
size=2 face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier New"'><br>
<tt><font face="Courier New">> directly with other vics and rats once they
are running – the only </font></tt><br>
<tt><font face="Courier New">> use the venue server to get the addresses
(unless you are using </font></tt><br>
<tt><font face="Courier New">> unicast, in which case there is a bridge
somewhere in the middle. </font></tt><br>
<tt><font face="Courier New">> This bridge takes your unicast traffic and
forwards it to multicast,</font></tt><br>
<tt><font face="Courier New">> and vice versa).</font></tt></span></font> <br>
<tt><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'>> 4)
Multicast address routing works differently from unicast address </span></font></tt><font
size=2 face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier New"'><br>
<tt><font face="Courier New">> routing. Basically, your router must be
multicast enabled to allow </font></tt><br>
<tt><font face="Courier New">> multicast to work from outside the router.
It is possible that it </font></tt><br>
<tt><font face="Courier New">> will allow multicast to work inside the LAN
without this, but I am </font></tt><br>
<tt><font face="Courier New">> not too sure. Your network card will
respond to both the 192 </font></tt><br>
<tt><font face="Courier New">> address assigned to it, and multicast
addresses, provided it has </font></tt><br>
<tt><font face="Courier New">> “joined” the multicast group i.e.
it has sent and IGMP message to </font></tt><br>
<tt><font face="Courier New">> the router saying that it wants to joint the
group and receive </font></tt><br>
<tt><font face="Courier New">> traffic addressed to that group.</font></tt></span></font>
<br>
<tt><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'>> </span></font></tt>
<br>
<tt><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'>> There
may be some things that are not quite right in the above, but </span></font></tt><font
size=2 face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier New"'><br>
<tt><font face="Courier New">> I’m sure someone on the list will
correct me if this is the case.</font></tt></span></font> <br>
<tt><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'>> </span></font></tt>
<br>
<tt><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'>> Andrew
J</span></font></tt> <br>
<tt><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'>>
============================================</span></font></tt><font size=2
face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier New"'><br>
<tt><font face="Courier New">> Access Grid Support Centre,</font></tt><br>
<tt><font face="Courier New">> RSS Group,</font></tt><br>
<tt><font face="Courier New">> <st1:City w:st="on"><st1:place w:st="on">Manchester</st1:place></st1:City>
Computing,</font></tt><br>
<tt><font face="Courier New">> <st1:place w:st="on"><st1:PlaceName w:st="on">Kilburn</st1:PlaceName>
<st1:PlaceType w:st="on">Building</st1:PlaceType></st1:place>,</font></tt><br>
<tt><font face="Courier New">> <st1:place w:st="on"><st1:PlaceType w:st="on">University</st1:PlaceType>
of <st1:PlaceName w:st="on">Manchester</st1:PlaceName></st1:place>,</font></tt><br>
<tt><font face="Courier New">> <st1:City w:st="on"><st1:place w:st="on">Oxford</st1:place></st1:City>
Road,</font></tt><br>
<tt><font face="Courier New">> <st1:City w:st="on"><st1:place w:st="on">Manchester</st1:place></st1:City>,</font></tt><br>
<tt><font face="Courier New">> M13 9PL,</font></tt><br>
<tt><font face="Courier New">> <st1:country-region w:st="on"><st1:place
w:st="on">UK</st1:place></st1:country-region></font></tt><br>
<tt><font face="Courier New">> Tel: +44(0)161-275 0685</font></tt><br>
<tt><font face="Courier New">> Email: <st1:PersonName w:st="on">Andrew.Rowley@manchester.ac.uk</st1:PersonName></font></tt></span></font>
<br>
<tt><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'>> </span></font></tt><font
size=2 face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier New"'><br>
<tt><font face="Courier New">> From: owner-<st1:PersonName w:st="on">ag-tech@mcs.anl.gov</st1:PersonName>
[mailto:owner-<st1:PersonName w:st="on">ag-tech@mcs.anl.gov</st1:PersonName>] </font></tt><br>
<tt><font face="Courier New">> On Behalf Of Fabrizio.Berdondini@prototipo.it</font></tt><br>
<tt><font face="Courier New">> Sent: 11 May 2006 08:29</font></tt><br>
<tt><font face="Courier New">> To: <st1:PersonName w:st="on">ag-tech@mcs.anl.gov</st1:PersonName></font></tt><br>
<tt><font face="Courier New">> Subject: [AG-TECH] Venues Addresses:
infrastructural question</font></tt></span></font> <br>
<tt><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'>> </span></font></tt>
<br>
<tt><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'>> </span></font></tt><font
size=2 face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier New"'><br>
<tt><font face="Courier New">> Hello all, </font></tt><br>
<tt><font face="Courier New">> while trying to resolve some troubles in our
internal subnet </font></tt><br>
<tt><font face="Courier New">> configuration, I was wondering how *exactly*
the VenueServer </font></tt><br>
<tt><font face="Courier New">> assigns/manages addresses for the venues.
What I know, from official</font></tt><br>
<tt><font face="Courier New">> documentation and from Thomas D. Uram
messages inside this m/list, </font></tt><br>
<tt><font face="Courier New">> is that the management of the IP for the
venues can be either static</font></tt><br>
<tt><font face="Courier New">> or dynamic, meaning that I can assign a fixed
IP to each venue (one </font></tt><br>
<tt><font face="Courier New">> for video, one for audio, and it will have
always the same) or let </font></tt><br>
<tt><font face="Courier New">> the venueserver assign the IPs inside a
variable range, giving them </font></tt><br>
<tt><font face="Courier New">> to audio/video of a venue when the first user
asks to enter it, </font></tt><br>
<tt><font face="Courier New">> while releasing them when the last person
into the venue leaves it. </font></tt><br>
<tt><font face="Courier New">> What I'm not able to understand is: </font></tt><br>
<tt><font face="Courier New">> </font></tt><br>
<tt><font face="Courier New">> 1) is the IP assigned to audio/video for each
room a *real* IP (a </font></tt><br>
<tt><font face="Courier New">> multicast IP publicly visible over the
internet i mean) or is there </font></tt><br>
<tt><font face="Courier New">> some kind of alias/routing sistem underlying
somewhere? </font></tt><br>
<tt><font face="Courier New">> 2) In the first case, how can the venue
server understand a </font></tt><br>
<tt><font face="Courier New">> particular IP is "free" or "used"
by someone else (i.e. another </font></tt><br>
<tt><font face="Courier New">> venueserver or another service)? </font></tt><br>
<tt><font face="Courier New">> 3) In the second case, how is the routing
done? How can the </font></tt><br>
<tt><font face="Courier New">> venueserver address the two applications Vic
and Rat (with some kind</font></tt><br>
<tt><font face="Courier New">> of DNS i guess) to the right IP? </font></tt><br>
<tt><font face="Courier New">> 4) Again in the second case, how can the
VenueServer assign/manage </font></tt><br>
<tt><font face="Courier New">> addresses in ranges like 224.xxx.xxx.xxx when
the allowed IPs inside</font></tt><br>
<tt><font face="Courier New">> a LAN are restricted to a range that goes
from 192.168.2.10 to 192.168.2.150? </font></tt><br>
<tt><font face="Courier New">> </font></tt><br>
<tt><font face="Courier New">> I'm not sure if I could explain clearly what
I'm looking for, but </font></tt><br>
<tt><font face="Courier New">> this matter, as far as now, is very critical
to me, I'm ready to </font></tt><br>
<tt><font face="Courier New">> give any further clarification and open to
every suggestion and information. </font></tt><br>
<tt><font face="Courier New">> Thanx as always, </font></tt><br>
<tt><font face="Courier New">> Faber B. </font></tt></span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
</body>
</html>